E530 | Why We Sold Our Practice

Aug 23, 2022
cash based physical therapy, danny matta, physical therapy biz, ptbiz, cash-based practice, cash based, physical therapy

Today, I sit down with my amazing wife Ashley to discuss why we sold our practice, Athletes' Potential. This was a big step in our entrepreneurial journey and I wanted to have her on to share with you all how we got here. This may be the goal with some when starting your practice and we hope this episode lets you know if you have a clear vision, you can follow the same path. Enjoy!

  • Seizing the opportunity to grow past yourself
  • Building something that is worth someone else buying
  • Selling to the right person that will continue to grow what you have built

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Podcast Transcript

Danny: [00:00:00] So one of the best ways to improve your customer experience, which we know will dramatically improve your business, is to have clear lines of communication with your clients. And that's something that can be really hard with these multiple channels between email and text. And what you really need is to centralize that in one place.

And that's something that we've been able to do as we switched over to PT everywhere within our client's accounts. We can actually message right back and forth with them. They can manage their home exercise plan within there, and it allows us to really compartmentalize the communication. That we have with those clients, instead of losing an email in the inbox or missing a text and, and then you're, it's very hard to dig yourself outta that hole because they feel like you're not very responsive, you know, with them.

And for us, it's made a really, really big difference. It helps make our staff more efficient. It helps us not miss things as much with the volume of people that we're working with. And it's a really smart way of really compartmentalizing your communication with your clients so it doesn't interfere with the rest of the channels.

You have communication with family and friends and things like that. So I think it'd be. Huge for your practice to centralize it the way we have. Head [00:01:00] over to pt Check out what our friends are doing over there. I think it's really cool and I think you really like it. So here's the question.

How do physical therapists like us who don't wanna see 30 patients a day, who don't wanna work home health and have real student loans create a career and life for ourselves that we've always dreamed about? This is the question, and this podcast is the answer. My name's Danny Mate, and welcome to the PT Entrepreneur Podcast.

What's going on guys? Dr. Danny here with the PT Entrepreneur Podcast, and I'm here today with my beautiful wife, Ashley. Yep. To talk about why we sold our practice. We, those of you don't know, uh, we started a practice together in 2014. [00:02:00] In Atlanta, um, June of 2014, and we sold it, uh, last month, or was it June?

Ashley: June of 2022.

Danny: So eight years later in, yeah, June of 2022, we sold our practice to, uh, one of our longtime, um, staff, uh, PTs, who had been functioning as the president of our company, um, helping run our company for, uh, the last, uh, two years. Two years basically, yeah. Before that. And, um, and we officially, you know, exited the, the business and, um, Sold it to, to Jake, handed it over to him.

And, uh, we want to talk about the process and why, and, you know, what that looks like and, and for us, why we decided to do it, and, uh, why maybe it's a good idea for you or not. Um, but just our experience with it to kind of share that and document that, uh, you know, that, that along the way, [00:03:00] because this is something that.

When, when, when we started Athlete's Potential, I had a couple people that I reached out to that were, um, That, that were in the business world in physical therapy, they had clinics and the consensus basically was, you know, Hey, that's cool. A cash-based practice sounds fun, you know, it's a, a hobby. Yeah. The, it was kind of like, oh, that's cute.

You know, enjoy that. But, you know, understand, you're never gonna grow that past yourself and you're just going to, you know, see a, an affluent population and have to be very niche specific and, and be okay with that. And, To be fair, we were fine with that cuz it was a better, uh, opportunity than the military, you know?

Um, next steps that I would've been taking that I just really wasn't interested in doing. Um, so we, that's what we did. And. You know, as we started to grow the practice, we realized [00:04:00] that, uh, the opportunity was, was bigger than what people had sort of told us. It it could have been and that we would, would be able to grow it past ourself.

And, and we did within about, what was it, about 18 months. Sure. 18 months to two years, somewhere in that range when we, you know, we brought on administrative, um, Help. We brought on other staff clinicians. We expanded to a standalone location. You know, we went through all the steps to have a legitimate business really, and, uh, and, and, you know, make that something that the goal being something that wasn't dependent, uh, specifically on us or even just my reputation to be able to bring patients in the door and to sustain itself.

And, um, that's a very hard thing to do. Uh, and something that we were able to do, you know, over that time period. And, you know, Over the last, I would say probably 12 months in particular, we really started to look more seriously at what it would look like to sell a practice. Um, and you know, [00:05:00] who we wanted to sell it to and the options that we had with that.

Um, And, and then going through the process over the last year has actually been like, pretty hard. Um, it's, you know, it's a lot, it's a lot to try to organize, to define like what something is worth. Cuz obviously it's worth a lot to us because we've put so much into it. Um, but when, when you are looking at the value of a business, it's very.

It's, it's very objective, right? It's, it's really much ba it's based off the financials more than anything else. Um, you know, so, but the process can be very tedious. And then there's different types of loan types and all kinds of other things. And, um, you know, and, and we don't necessarily get into all the details of everything on this podcast, but we wanna share the main reasons why, you know, we did this and, and the really, the, the big one for us was we found that we felt like we found the right fit for the person we wanted to take over the business.

Um, after us. And that's, I feel like that was hard. You know, [00:06:00] just like relinquishing something that means, uh, just, uh, so much to us, well, was tough. I would

Ashley: say in our situation, I feel like it worked out really well because I do more of the operations of the business and Danny was more of a. The visionary, I guess you could say.

I'm not sure

Danny: what I do. Yeah, show up. Show up and make a coffee and talk to people.

Ashley: Uh, anyways, Jacob, that we sold the practice to. Is very, very similar to Danny. So Jacob and I have worked really well together. If Jacob had come in and had been more of my role, I don't think that we would have worked very well together these last two years, um, because you have to have those good, um, balances like.

If it was up to me, I would just be running a, a business all day long. All year, all year rounds. Like I wouldn't have any need for growth [00:07:00] because I just like things to be steady. But you need somebody like Danny and someone like Jacob that has a long-term plan and vision for the practice. Um, and then someone like me to make sure that it actually happened.

So, I think it has worked really well, um, these last couple of years working with Jacob and then us being able to see, oh, he can do this, and we feel very comfortable handing our third child off to someone that we know is not going to mess this up or run it into the ground or ruin his reputation. The clinic's reputation.

There's no. Um, worry about anything like

Danny: that. Yeah, I, I think that what Ashley just touched on was the, the two roles of, oh, is this where you repeat what I just said? This is where I'm gonna repeat what you said and make it sound like it was my idea, which I'm pretty damn good at. The, the, the, the, what, what she said really is like visionary and, and integrator or operator and when.

Typically when people start a practice, um, it's just one person [00:08:00] and they're doing everything. I was fortunate to where like, that never really was the case for me because we started together. Well, no, you tried to. Well, uh, yeah, but I mean, part of that was because you were at home with two little kids, right?

Like it wasn't that, uh, That, you know, I, I had much of a choice necessarily, but it was early on when you started getting involved with, especially like, building systems. And, and I remember like you looked at, I had like a Google, I had like a Google, uh, folder of like notes and I remember you were like, this is a bad idea.

Like we've gotta do something better than this. And, you know, started to really organize and, and you know, sy systemize the business and, um, It's not, that's not something that I'm very good at, at all. And uh, that's something that Ashley's really good at. And, you know, when we, when. You know, we started looking at, you know, if the, uh, you know, if Jake was the right fit for us to move this over to.

And, um, he had a lot of this, you know, same, you know, uh, characteristics that I do in terms of the beneficial things of being able to like, build relationships [00:09:00] and, and have a big vision and, and compel people to wanna be a part of that and get them excited about it. Um, but he was also taking over a business that was already very.

Uh, systemized. It was very well run also with, uh, an office manager in place that had been there for six years. So, you know that she's still there and she's still there. Yeah. And she's, and, and she's. Uh, taking, um, you know, some of the roles that Ashley's doing and Jake is gonna be doing some of those. Um, but we're, you know, we're setting them up in a way where that, that still exists at.

And a lot of times if somebody starts a business and they're doing both, they really have to find the other, and it's kind of rare for somebody that's an operator to start a business. It's more so like the visionary role, kind of what I was in. Um, and then they run into trouble when they start to scale.

Because they're not very good at organizing things and having repeatable measures and tracking things and all of that. Um, so they might, you know, hire an operator or they might bring somebody on that's in more of an office manager role or whatever it might be. But you need both of those. So we felt comfortable that both of those [00:10:00] exist between the, between the two of them.

Um, you know, and, and the big thing for us was, you know, there's this ambition there that, that. You know, it's, it, we re we respect it a lot because it's like the vision of, uh, what, what our practice would've been if we hadn't started a, you know, PT biz is what we hope it turns into. And what, what I, I think is going to happen, hopefully, is that it trends that direction where there's growth occurring, there's more people that we're able to employ.

Um, there's more people that we're able to help because, you know, for us, uh, maintaining those values, And being able to fulfill what we hope can happen with the company is actually far more important to us than whatever we could have sold the company to, to other people. Which, you know, it, it was, it's valuable and it could run without any, you know, person really involved.

Um, and we could definitely have sold it to like a hospital system or a local ortho group for, for significantly more than, uh, than what we [00:11:00] sold the business for because of how much we value the, the core values. And it not. You know, being ruined by somebody that just wants to take our list of all these thousands of people we worked with and then just roll them into their, you know, whatever practice that they, they want to absorb that into.

So that meant a lot to us. And I know, I know for you that that meant a lot too, right? Yes. So number two, unable, uh, we're, we are unable to grow two businesses, um, at once. So what we found was, uh, when we really started focusing, and in particular me started focusing. More on PT biz. Uh, the, the, the growth, the the growth side of things.

The person pushing to do more and more in the business to, to grow and to work towards like a, a vision of the future of what we want it to be. That basically was removed and then it was more about maintaining one business and trying to grow the other one. Um, I. Don't know, I, I, it's probably possible for somebody to grow multiple businesses at once, [00:12:00] but it's not possible for us.

We don't have that, that skillset. Um, and you know, we learned that over a few years of, of really k running both. And it was not just a detriment to athlete's potential, but is a detriment to both. Athletes potential and PT biz because of split attention, uh, versus being focused on one thing. And it, it's funny because we, we talk to other business owners about this all the time, and they're like, oh, what if I do this side project and this or that?

And I'm like, you're just going to slow everything down if you do that. Um, you know, so ironically we did what we tell a lot people not to do. And in order to get all that mental bandwidth back and really focus on one thing, we felt like, you know, we, we really needed to, uh, just. You know, move away from one thing and just solely focus on, you know, on, on, on the other.

Um, and you know, for us it's, it's something that we really enjoyed running. We really enjoyed the business. Um, we really enjoy the staff and, [00:13:00] and I wish we could grow, grow both at the same time, but we just, we just can't. So for us being able to have somebody that is going to be able to provide more growth opportunities for our people, To, you know, allow them to move up and be a part of something that's like, it's so much more fun to be a part of something that's growing than something that's just stagnant.

Like there's a completely different sort of, uh, energy that you feel as you, if you're a part of something that's like, you know, that has momentum. You know, and I feel like for us, that's something that we just completely took out of the equation because we basically said no to all growth opportunities cuz we were just like, no, we're good.

Like we're just gonna play defense and play it safe. And then we did that for a long time and I think that's frustrating for people that want to grow cl grow quickly. What do you think? Uh, I

Ashley: agree and I mean, I think, uh, a lunch pen in this last two years has been dealing with a global pandemic and it's just like, Let's just stay consistent and just try to rebound from that, which we luckily did.

Um, so I know a [00:14:00] lot of businesses that weren't as lucky, so I mean, I feel fortunate that we were able to not. To have been as affected by Covid? Well, actually, I mean, we were, but

Danny: no, I, our area is very, very, I mean, one of the more restricted areas for a long period of time. I mean, just for where it's located.

Yes. And, uh, and, and, and I don't know if I would say it was lucky. I mean, I, I don't know, like I've ever worked harder and been more stressed, worked

Ashley: hard. Jacob was in the office with zero patience doing anything possible, right, to keep patients coming in the door. Like we, the three of us just worked really hard, um, to maintain athlete's potential through that time.

And honestly, that was one of the things that was eye-opening for us. Like Jacob's give a shit factor through something that was very volatile. Um, I, I think meant a lot. So,

Danny: uh, com I completely agree. You know, and it's, you know, just, but, but part of, part of that is just seeing how somebody, you know, works in a situation when it's, uh, you know, not less than ideal.

[00:15:00] And that, I feel like that tells you a lot about somebody and, and how they respond. And, I mean, our office manager was great during that as well, you know, so, you know, for us, um, That, that just gave us a lot of confidence that we were moving the business over to the right person and that, you know, that they had the ambition and the vision to wanna really, you know, see the business grow past where we were willing to take it.

Because I mean, in all honesty, we could have just auto piloted this business and, and, you know, um, Ashley could have continued to operate it. And, you know, it's, it's not something that even requires like full-time hours on her part being there. Um, You know, so for a lot of people they told us and they were like, I don't know if this is a good idea.

You just hold onto this as an investment. And I agree. I think financially it probably would've been, um, you know, a good idea to do that. But for, for us, it's just so much more than that. Like, it's, it's, it's not just it, it's not, I, I don't know. It's not just a place where we want people to go and make us money.

Like it's a place that we want to see be. Be bigger than that. And, and we think it, it's, it's gonna [00:16:00] be interesting to see where athlete's potential is in three years in comparison to where it is now. Uh, and, and, and that's, you know, part of why we decided to, uh, you know, decided to sell the business. And, and it's not so much for us as much as it is.

For the business itself, but all the people that work within it and having the opportunity to like see that, you know, really grow and thrive and, um, you know, and I look forward to seeing that. Cause I think, I think it, you know, just be in such a different place if we hadn't split our attention and, and started mul, you know, started a whole other business that turned into, you know, something that was significantly bigger than we expected.

All right. Number three. Um, we had something to move onto. You know, I get this question a lot and people are, People in our mastermind in particular, you know, they see some of the things that we do and, and, um, and they're like, oh, maybe I should do the same thing. And, and maybe, maybe they should, but.

Selling your practice without another thing to move on to that, that is at least as good of an opportunity, if not better, doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Um, [00:17:00] unless you're just tired of it. You know, if you're just tired and you're like, all right, I don't see an end inside, I'm done. I'm exhausted.

I, you know, I want to go back to doing something easier. Uh, that happens for sure. But for a lot of people, this is their best opportunity and it's something that, For them, you know, really creates a lot of time and financial freedom and, and the sale of these businesses. Not like you're selling a software company, you know, for 10 times.

Whatever the company is making. Like it's, you know, it's, that's not the case. These businesses are far less valuable. They're, they're not valued the same way. Um, so you're not walking away with, you know, life changing amount of money. Um, you wouldn't have to work for a few years, uh, you know, at a, at, at a minimum, but, Uh, it's not an, it's, there's just more value there than what you're giving up if you're running the business and being a part of it.

So, you know, for us, we had something to move on to. And PT Biznow, you know, we've been, we've been doing this in one variation or another for about five years and. As that business has continued to grow, it's, it's been very apparent to [00:18:00] us that when we look at the profession and, and the niches that we help in, the cash and sort of hybrid world, especially these performance practices, um, you know, we see a lot of people training that direction.

We see a lot of businesses that are starting and growing, and there's a lot more work than we thought we would have. And there's a lot more people that we, you know, can help and serve. And, uh, and so. That's the direction that, you know, we've turned, we are turning our attention completely to, uh, because we feel like that's the, the best, really the best way to use our skillset and the best opportunity that we have, you know, at this point.

So, you know, if he didn't have something else, um, I don't know why you would, why you would sell. I don't know. What do you think? Oh, I

Ashley: have nothing to add. That's,

Danny: I agree. That's it. Yeah. This is gonna be very, uh, one-sided. I'm gonna, I'm gonna finish out this fourth one then. So, um, the last thing is we built something, uh, worth buying.

And I think that that is,

Ashley: I feel like that's where we've put in [00:19:00] all the work. I don't

Danny: know. Well, it's interesting to, to build something with the intent of you not needing to be there. It feels weird, you know? It's like, uh, you know, it's, this thing started with you. Every, you know, there's really, you started with nothing and then all of a sudden it's like, you don't even need to be there.

It's kind, it's kind of strange, but it's the way that it needs to be built. Otherwise, it's a, uh, It's a sketchy business to own because, you know, if, if your reputation drives everything, if you're the only one doing everything, and let's say something catastrophic happens, you know, or not even catastrophic, but let's just say you have a, you know, a significant injury that takes you out of being able to provide care.

You have no income, like it is not a, uh, it's not a safe place to be. And building past yourself and having that. In some variation of passive income. Obviously you're still working on it, but you're not necessarily fulfilling everything, uh, is a much safer place to be. [00:20:00] And what's funny is like if you build people the right way and you mentor them and they do what, you know, and you build the systems out the right way, um, it can be run without you, like, you don't have to be around.

I mean, I really, for the last, what, year and a half, I guess I haven't, I haven't even seen patients. We've

Ashley: not seen you in the office in two and a half years, sir.

Danny: Yeah. It felt like I was going into a stranger's clinic. Sometimes I'd show up and, and, uh, I didn't know who any of these patients were. I. I, I would, uh, make a cup.

Yeah, I'd say like two years. Two years. Yeah. But I mean, but for me, like I would show up, I'd make a cup of coffee, I would make Claire very inefficient for about an hour while, you know, her and I went back and forth talking about whatever, um, I would go screw up somebody doing blood flow restriction training cause I'm teaching 'em to exercise the wrong way.

And then I would realize, you know what, I should probably just leave. And I'll go home cause because, uh, uh, I wasn't even needed anymore besides, you know, maybe just like a, you know, a random conversation that isn't necessarily needed to have in the [00:21:00] office.

Ashley: Well, I will say that part's not true because we, for the last two years, although you've not been doing patient care behind the scenes, we've been meeting with Jacob.

I meet with Jacob weekly, and then we would have a meeting with all three of us for two hours, once a month to review financials, all of that stuff, and projections. Um, so yeah, I would say you might not be forward facing, but it's not like you still haven't put a lot of thought and effort into the business.

Danny: Yeah, no, that's true. I mean, in the, on the back end of the business, like more of like a cfo, you know, kind of. Position looking at those things and the data and, and all that. I mean, it, it, yes, there's definitely work associated with it, but, but it's um, as far as like just being there in person. Correct. Um, that that's really the thing that, that most people don't work themselves out of.

Mm-hmm. And it's not that you have to either, like, I get this question a lot and people are like, so do I eventually have to stop seeing patients, you know? And I, and my answer is, [00:22:00] Do you want to stop seeing patients you know? And if they say no, they really like clinical care, then then I say, cool, like build your schedule to where you have an ideal mix of being able to see patients, but also still being able to support your people.

Because in the clinical world, like. The, the clinicians, at least, and Ashley can see this from a different lens because she's a non-clinical, she runs these businesses. Um, but for me, like I get it from the clinical side where, you know, most people we work with have gone to school for a long time. They have.

Uh, worked really hard on ConEd courses and advanced training. Spent a lot of time just like getting good at the craft, and they start a business and they are getting great outcomes for people, and then they're growing past themself. And what happens? The natural transition goes from, you know, you're kind of doing everything to, then you kind of turn into like a player coach.

So now you're, you're still in the game treating patients, but now you're [00:23:00] mentoring other providers so that they can have similar outcomes. To what you're getting and the way that, that there's like something about how you're working with people that needs to be replicated with your other folks. Yeah.

You gotta systemize that. You have to systemize it and you have to mentor them. You have to spend time with them. And so, but then once you start to have a few people, the time that it requires to spend with those folks to, and, and anybody else in your business. It's actually quite a bit of time. So you can have a full-time patient schedule.

Just you, you can't do both. Otherwise you're sacrificing mentoring your team and growing your team and growing your business. Um, so if you decide to do that, you're always gonna be kind of stuck at a certain stage, but you know, you could be. You can have a huge practice and still have a day, maybe two days a week of clinical care, if that's really what you, you like.

I mean, I know people that have far bigger practices than us that are still seeing patients two days a week cuz they really like it and they kind of define who they like to work with. And um, you know, it's a nice mixture. Also keeps

Ashley: your skills sharp and then it helps you as the. Clinic owner, whatever your position may be, stay in [00:24:00] touch with what your PTs are continuing to see and how you can continue to craft your skill in order to teach them.

Yeah, and I think that's very helpful cuz a lot of people that just wanna get out of patient care as fast as they can. I, I do think, okay, that's great, but why did you go to school? But again, I'm not a pt.

Danny: No. I mean, I think for a lot of people they get bored with it, you know, after a certain amount of time.

It's sort of like, it's not really challenging for them anymore. And at that point that, that for me, that like I kind of gotta to that point and I realized I. Okay, this is getting a bit redundant. Obviously you can always get better, but, um, there's sort of like a marginal return on your time after a certain point, uh, in terms of the outcomes you're getting.

But what really is, uh, reinvigorating and fun with the profession is to then like work with other people and mentor other people because you're helping them get better, but they're also helping you because you're having to really like clarify your thoughts, your frameworks of how you work with folks.

And that's challenging to do cuz you. Because you, maybe you've been doing so long that it's just sort of second nature, but [00:25:00] to be able to like really explain that and teach that to somebody else, and then also like get, you know, feedback from them to where you have to, maybe you're challenged in a, in a positive way, but you have to better understand why you're doing certain things the way you are in comparison to like what.

Current evidence and trends are, and things like that. So, you know, I think it's just a matter of like continual growth in some way. Um, clinically that just helps a lot with your staff as you're, you're helping them grow. So, um, you know, getting to the point where your team is doing like things similar to what you are and it's a similar customer experience, then all of a sudden, like that's when you can kind of, um, You could kind of disappear if you wanted to because the brand is now bringing people in.

The brand is what people are associating with, with high quality. Not necessarily, oh, you gotta go see Danny, or you gotta go see whoever. It's, you gotta go to Athletes Potential because they're awesome. And that is something that is very difficult, I think, to work towards. And I, I wouldn't say that we probably got to that until it was [00:26:00] probably what, like six, five or six years in?

No. What do you think?

Ashley: No sooner than

Danny: that. Sooner than that? Yeah. Okay. So let's call it like three or four. But either way, it doesn't happen in a year. Like it doesn't happen fast.

Ashley: No, it doesn't happen fast. And it doesn't happen without

Danny: a lot of work. Right, right. And it's, and it's also, it comes down to your branding, it comes down to your, you know, your messaging.

Consistency. Yeah, consistency. Like a lot of people, they just want to just highlight themselves. Uh, because it makes 'em feel good. Um, versus like really taking yourself out of it and building something. You know, that is, you're building a, a business versus a, uh, a lifestyle business, right? If you want a lifestyle business, you wanna be the go-to person for whatever, and just be that forever, then that's fine.

That you don't need to scale past yourself. You can just do that. But that, and that's a lot easier to do than be able to build something that functions when you're not there, right? So, um, you know, and, and, and Rob would say, really the last piece for us of why we did this was, um, It's a learning process.

We want to know what it's like to [00:27:00] start scale, you know, and then sell a, uh, a practice because we have a lot of people we work with that are in all stages of that, and it helps us be better mentors to them to have, you know, gone through it ourself and not necessarily just, um, try to come up with solutions to problems that we don't know anything about.

You know, it's, you never want to be, uh, like a false prophet and tell people to do things that you think work, but you've never actually done yourself. I think there's far too much of that out there. Very few people in, in the space that are doing, you know, business to business coaching. Uh, Ha have, have really, you know, done what they're trying to tell you to do.

Mm-hmm. Because it's probably too hard for them to have done themself. And so, but it's easier for them to like, talk about it and try to educate other people and be a slick marketer. And I see that all the time. Shots fired. Shots fired. Man. There's a lot of, there's a lot of people out there that are, that are charlatan's and you may not know what you're getting yourself into.

Um, but it's the [00:28:00] truth because it's hard to tell if somebody's just a good marketer and they can spin things different ways. Like I've, I've heard people and I'm definitely not gonna like, just. You know, whatever, name any names. But there's plenty of people that I've heard that say they've done certain things that they actually haven't done, uh, because it just makes them look more credible.

Um, but it's pretty apparent when you start to talk to somebody or work with somebody, uh, the de the depth of knowledge and understanding that you get from actually having gone through something and the, the. Stress involved with that and the effort involved with that. Like you can't re replicate that by reading a book or, you know, going through somebody else's course to learn something.

You just can't do it. Um, you have to do it yourself. Um, can I

Ashley: wrap this up? Yeah, you can. So I would say we started athlete's potential because we wanted a place where our friends, our family, could seek out physical therapy that's not that traditional end network clinic where they're just not gonna get that high quality of care.

And for us, obviously everything that we've listed out [00:29:00] here, or Danny really has, but still led us to this point to set Jacob up to the, in the best possible position to continue and actually grow. What our long-term goal has been, we just want to continue providing quality physical therapy care to people in and around Atlanta.

And she's already actually expanded to, uh, Columbus, Ohio, so we. Love Jacob, um, and his family, and we're super excited for him. But the goal has always been to provide high quality of care. And so I we're excited to see him

Danny: continue that. Yeah, e exactly. It's, uh, you know, it's, it's good to hand it off to somebody.

You know, that, that shares values in somebody that can. You know, call us if he has a question and, and, you know, know that, that, uh, you know, we can help him sort of resolve something. But it's also, it's cool to still be able to also be, um, you know, A around the group of people that we worked with. [00:30:00] You know, they're just, they're just fun people and it's, it's enjoyable to spend time with them and, um, you know, so that we've enjoyed that as well.

Just still being able to, uh, you know, be a part of what's going on without necessarily, you know, running the business. Yes. And, uh, so anyway, so that's, uh, that's why we sold. So I hope that, uh, I hope that helps. I hope that makes sense. You know, for us, um, we've, we've gotten a lot of questions about it, and it's, and, and it's so funny, it's like, you know, uh, I've had people, they're like, oh my God is like, Is, do I need to get out now?

You know, and I, I like, no, there's, I don't know, something you don't know. Like this is, uh, this was just a decision we made at the time because of this, you know? So, um, I think you're still good to go. I see a lot of opportunity. I see a lot of potential. Um, you know, and people ask me all the time, they're like, what, what's gonna, what, what's gonna take, you know, this business model out.

And I, I really just think the only thing that does is, is if insurance becomes like significantly better and all of a sudden they start reimbursing a lot more and deductibles are going down and people have less out of pocket, you know, that they owe. [00:31:00] And um, I mean that hasn't been the case for the last 20 years, so I just don't see it.

Can't see it reversing anytime soon. I think you can't unring this bell at this point. There's no way that, that they can go that direction. So I'm very, very, uh, you know, excited about the future of these, these practices and these types of businesses and, and, uh, you know, we look forward to really being able to focus specifically and solely on one thing, and that is helping everybody else, you know, grow their practices and, and, uh, and really starting to, um, you know, try to make a massive dent in some of the, you know, lower quality practices that we just get so frustrated with.

So anyway, as always, thanks for listening, Ashley. Thanks for the annual appearance, the one, the once a year we get you in here.

Ashley: Not a problem. I was happy to pause Renaissance and,

Danny: uh, come on from, got you to stop listening to Beyonce for all of about 31 minutes, so, all right. Cool guys. Thanks so much for listening and we'll catch you next week.

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